November 21st, 2006 by Atomictumor
Well, folks, this kinda sucks.
I’m not real sure what to do now. I made all the plans and whatnot, have had a good three family members counsel me against the diamond, suggesting that I wait (although it seems to me that the money I’d have spent on a grave/tombstone/coffin would have been about the same amount, and probably wouldn’t be a wait kinda thing.
Folks, I’m know you mean well, but it ain’t helping.
Besides, BJ hasn’t made any money for the family in the past few years any, being that she’s a student. Seems to me that things are just getting cheaper with one less mouth to feed, if you want to get just straight up and factual about it. I mean, those Ramen noodles were taking up 75 cents a piece, easy!
Grumble grumble grumble.
I don’t want to sound like a dick, but thats just what my fingers type.
—
Kids are playing outside, and I’ve been setting up the lappy for bit torrent and whatnot. Pigpen is frantically shooting MastaG with his finger. Its a noisy finger. The bigger kids tend to like to make Pigpen the bad guy, so he just chases them all over the place. Doesn’t sound fair, but who am I to interfere with the pecking order of children? That, and I’m certain that in another 7 years or so, Pigpen will outweigh MastaG anyway, and be able to pay him back in spades.
Yep, I won’t interfere with that either, unless it gets ugly.
—
Daco swung by earlier, and we hung out. Its pretty mean, I like for my friends to get here, but then when they get here I’d kinda like them to leave. And then when they leave, I wish I hadn’t run them out.
Maybe I’m pregnant?
November 21st, 2006 at 5:03 pm
Hmm….are your breasts tender?
I can’t wait to come home and see you again. I Love you.
November 21st, 2006 at 5:13 pm
Early menopause.
November 21st, 2006 at 5:13 pm
Motherhood….a the joys. Wait, err, are you an hermaphrodite? Is that one of the secrets you kept from BJ?
I can’t possible tell you what to do about the diamond thing, really no one can, its your decision. But since this has happened my husband and I have had many discussions and have decided (and informed our kids) that if at the time that its time if there is any way we can come up with the money, that is what we are going to do. (that right there is a very poorly constructed sentence, it must be nap time).
November 21st, 2006 at 5:16 pm
“Maybe I’m pregnant?”
In that case I’ll make something with chocolate in it.
November 21st, 2006 at 5:17 pm
bottom line, it is YOUR decision, nobody else’s. That thread you posted earlier showed that the diamond was BJ’s wishes anyway.
YOU do what you feel is right. People mean well trying to give you advice, but it comes down to the fact that it is YOUR wife, YOUR family, YOUR decision.
thinking of you.
November 21st, 2006 at 5:22 pm
You decide what you think is right. Some things don’t have a logical price.
Me? I am one of the most fiscally conservative people on the planet (ask my husband), and I thought the diamond was brilliant (pardon the pun).
I am telling you this again (as if you don’t think I am already crazy). Find a copy of “Rocketman”. Watch it. Go for the diamond.
November 21st, 2006 at 5:30 pm
I found your website today. My heart aches for you. I am at work and can’t even work now… all I can do is think of you, your boys, BJ. And wonder why.
And for the diamond? Screw everyone else. Do what feels right in YOUR heart.
November 21st, 2006 at 5:32 pm
I’m thinking it’s PMS, not pregnancy. The good news: it doesn’t last as long. The bad news: it always comes back, and you don’t get anything for it except assurance that you’re not pregnant.
Tough couple of days, my friend. Hang in there.
November 21st, 2006 at 5:38 pm
I think logic went out the F***’n window about four weeks back. Now’s time to do what is best for you and your kids. If it is a dam big diamond to remember their mom by — then do it. We can help make it happen. If the parents need something different that is above and beyond what BJ wanted — then just tell them to find a way and that you are on a mission to do right by your wife. I know this is a lot of directives — it is meant to be encouragement that what you decide is the right thing.
My sisters when I was growing up tried to convince me that I was going to menstrate some day when I least expected it. Being under informed I tragically fell for it in my young age. Sisters can be horrible. I should have told them on some off day that I did.
tg
November 21st, 2006 at 5:39 pm
“I mean, those Ramen noodles were taking up 75 cents a piece, easy!”
Damn, those must’ve been some fancy ramen noodles.
“Maybe I’m pregnant?”
Are you implying that I run people out?
November 21st, 2006 at 5:40 pm
Nah, everybody else means well, so I don’t bear any bad will or anything, just a general irritation. They’re looking out for me, so they’re good people. Its just that I think BJ and I operated in a very alien way, and I’m doing what BJ and I would have done had we been able to make the decision together.
Thats something that sucks, is not having her wisdom to bounce decisions like this off, although her answer was always “whatever you want to do, baby” while really sending all those subliminal clues as to what my decision SHOULD be, and getting pissed if I make the wrong one.
November 21st, 2006 at 5:57 pm
Ah, the time-honored “do what you want, baby but don’t make the wrong decision” marital dance! Gotta love us wives for that one. Good times, good times…
I think your insight into the fact that you and BJ never exactly did things the way everybody else did anyway is a very valid one. I guess I can also see how the whole diamond idea might strike some people as spending money on something that seems really weird and kind of like a macabre gesture of some sort– but though I don’t know either one of you, may I be bold enough to suggest that from what I pick up from reading the archives, it just seems like a perfectly logical choice, and one that BJ would truly appreciate the absurdity/beauty of.
This is another vote for “only you can make the decision, there isn’t really a WRONG way to do this, it just needs to feel right to you regardless of how it strikes others.”
And I agree that the (undesired) input is totally done out of love, concern and a feeling of helplessness, however intrusive it must seem.
Not unlike this post…
Tori
November 21st, 2006 at 6:00 pm
Damn did I marry the wrong girl! Every time I mention the new Harley that I would love to see under the Christmas tree…“whatever you want to do, baby” ain’t exactly the response I receive.
November 21st, 2006 at 6:07 pm
When I need to make a decision about something difficult I think about all my options in my head, I imagine doing them and what would happen afterwards, the one that just feels right and I don’t know how to describe it but I just feel it, well thats the one I go with.
Probably a load of crap but it works for me.
Thinking of you and your darling boys. X
November 21st, 2006 at 6:18 pm
In everybody’s defense, people love you and want to help you. The diamond is an awesome idea, but I’m afraid I agree that those who are offering it are taking advantage of the bereaved, and that’s sick. On the other hand, I think it’s an awesome idea, and what it really all boils down to is money’s just money, and there are lots of things that you can never put a price tag on. If that is what helps you and the boys find any tiny bit of comfort in this tragedy, then more power to you. Make that diamond as big as you can make it, then put it on a big ol’ gold chain around your hairy chest. Or even better, have it mounted in your front tooth. We’ll help you in any way that we possibly can.
November 21st, 2006 at 6:18 pm
I know what you mean about doing things the alien way. Our wedding was like that - no one got it and didn’t really agree with it until they were there and had a great time and then said “ya know… that wasn’t half bad”. Screw them all!
The thing about most people is they want conventional. They want “normal”, they need traditional - and I don’t always get why. You’ll do what you need to do - it’ll all get figured out.
November 21st, 2006 at 6:25 pm
http://jewelry.about.com/cs/syntheticdiamonds/a/lifegem_diamond.htm
I thought this was interesting, and maybe legitimizes the whole thing. Not really a lot of information, but there you go.
November 21st, 2006 at 6:34 pm
I love the diamond idea. I told my husband about it today, and said he could use it to make an engagement ring to give to his new wife should he ever find one. He laughed. He didn’t realize I was being serious…
Anyway, like some others said, do what you want, and what you think she would have wanted. It is YOUR wife everyone is talking about here.
November 21st, 2006 at 6:39 pm
I like your husband melusina.
November 21st, 2006 at 6:58 pm
Totally unsolicited, but here’s my $0.02.
1) Do what you feel in your heart is the right and best thing for you, BJ, and the boys.
2) Do what you feel in your heart BJ would have felt is the right and best thing for you, her, and the boys.
Whatever the specifics of everyone’s concerns, maybe things could be worked out to something that will make everyone happy? If you want one thing and someone else wants another and someone else wants something else, maybe there’s a possibility that all can be managed?
November 21st, 2006 at 7:00 pm
Dear Nephew, I think that doing something special to remember BJ always is perfectly the right thing to do. But BJ wasn’t silly. The diamond thing comes up as a lovely idea on the surface but I don’t know how seriously you and she researched either the process or the company at the time you first came across the idea. As you must be aware the “diamond” is not a natural diamond. One brand name is Moissenite, there are others, and they are all manmade products, laboratory grown. You can google it. As for the company, I know nothing about it, except that they are charging $20000 for what sells tops for $700 per carat, for absolutely perfect stones. What guarantee, beyond their sayso, do you even have that it would be ashes you provide that would be used, and not complete scam? It is bad enough that they take advantage of grief.
Since you invited us to go to the website, we did, and then found out more, and shared it with you, and now with everybody else.
So make the decision that is best for you and for BJ’s memory, and if you think that turning her into a lovely little diamond is the best way to do so then at least we have helped you to make an informed decision. If you want to be mad, that is your choice. I love you anyway. I will not say another word.
November 21st, 2006 at 7:10 pm
I’ve already provided my $0.02… and you laughed about it. Laughter is good.
November 21st, 2006 at 7:14 pm
Totally none of my business, but from that about.com article what I gleaned was that the diamond is made from a process that occurs during cremation, not from the ashes themselves. I don’t know what the concerns are, but if the family concern is that they want a more traditional resting place for BJ, they can still have it, while you can still have your diamond.
Thoughts are with you and your boys. It sounds like you are surrounded by loving people at every turn.
November 21st, 2006 at 7:26 pm
Could be early menopause?
November 21st, 2006 at 7:27 pm
All I can say is F@ck em all. It is your wife. Do what makes the most sense to you. And the best thing is that you dont have to decide right now. Give yourself time.
November 21st, 2006 at 7:28 pm
I call the well intentioned busybodies the peanut gallery, as in - “The peanut gallery thinks we shouldn’t do this or that.” The peanut gallery cares but you already know that you make your decisions based on what you think is best for you and your children. Smile, nod and stumble forward.
November 21st, 2006 at 7:38 pm
Well, see, what eats at me is that some of the people giving me this advice really just don’t know me from Adam. I mean, they seem to assume that I’m in the habit of making massive loose fisted financial decisions, like I just run off and buy a boat, or something. Or they think that I don’t research things like this, like maybe I haven’t been reading every link about it since the 17th, when the option came up.
Or they think I’m not well versed in science, or economics, that maybe they’re under the impression that I say DIAMOND I’m thinking its one of the official mined-in-south-africa-by-debeers thing (which is a whole other kind of rip off, as since the discovery of abundant diamond resources in Africa threatened to devalue the gem in the 19th century, rich Europeans have kept supply so tight that the prices have stayed insanely high) and created by millions of years of tectonics. I’m fully aware that artificial diamonds have been created.
So lets do this. Lets assume, folks, that I know what I’m talking about when I make a big decision like this. We’ll just go ahead and humor me that way.
Because, obviously, I’m grieving too much right now to make any kind of real decision.
This is the last I will speak of this subject. It is closed.
November 21st, 2006 at 7:40 pm
Technically I suppose she would not be a “diamond,” but she wasn’t one before either. The thing about the LifeGem is not whether it is a “diamond” in the scientific sense, but whether it is in some way BJ. I think they can make one or more gem and still leave more “traditional” remains if that is the route that you choose.
Gosh, I’m awfully sorry this is all playing out like this. At the end of the day it falls only to you to make this choice without all of our many pennies in the mix. (Um, but maybe not in your very front tooth - that could be painful.)
November 21st, 2006 at 7:42 pm
Sorry AT, it took me so long to phrase that last post that you posted in there. Please don’t think I meant to reopen something closed. I’ll be quiet now. :-)
November 21st, 2006 at 7:43 pm
You’re totally cool, dude!
November 21st, 2006 at 7:45 pm
She’s right. You really won’t know what you’re getting If you guys were on the same page,buy her a star. It’s something you and the boys can share and always be looking up to find her. Or just point one out and name it after her. It doesn’t cost a dime. Hang in there man I admire your courage. This BUD’S FOR YOU
November 21st, 2006 at 7:51 pm
I love the diamond idea. I love it more because she was the one to say it. I love it even more because it seems right, like it was meant to be somehow. The day she died, before you even knew she would die that day, you posted about it. It gave me chills. Go with your gut, you are doing the right thing, and I don’t blame you at all for being angry. {{hugs}}
November 21st, 2006 at 7:55 pm
Hmm, is this topic off-limits or isn’t it? I think it’s a pretty funny and surreal thing to debate about. Er, of course it’s not a natural diamond, as if it were it couldn’t be made of cremated remains, right? Nor is perfection probably the issue, as in fact it isn’t with a human person either. But the expense is impressive. Maybe the right solution is to make a SMALL diamond. Oh, just kidding. But you’ve got to see the funny side of this…
November 21st, 2006 at 7:58 pm
Ok, well, one more thing from me then: I was thinking about our messaging back and forth a few weeks ago about Radha, and I remembered an old Hindu story about Syamantaka. Syamantaka was a jewel that was given by Surya, the sun god, to one of his devotees. If it were worn by a virtuous person, it would yield eight loads of gold daily and inexhaustible good luck, and if it were worn by a bad person, it would be deadly to the wearer. As you might imagine, there’s a lot of back and forth mythology about this gem and who had it and who wanted it, but (getting back to the point) one of the 108 names of Radha is “She upon whose wrist the beautiful Syamantaka jewel shines.”
For whatever little it’s worth, and of course, you can look up more if you ever feel like it. Peace, brother Jake.
November 21st, 2006 at 8:17 pm
OK, lemme see if I can stop being an whiny kid about this, and talk about it constructively (even though I said I wouldn’t)
I am skeptical. Totally. Yah, its expensive, and I’m not going to get a big one. Just a little guy. I have no clue what I would do with it. I’m not going to rush off and send it in tomorrow, although I’ll be getting the ashes tomorrow, and don’t feel much like keeping em.
I’m completely skeptical. In fact, when I spoke with one of their people on the phone, she told me something about the jewels being different hues, which is unique to the person, because of the DNA.
Bollocks. DNA didn’t survive the burn today. If its unique, its because of the minute difference in atmospheric composition, heat, and pressure in the creation of the diamond.
So yeah, they’re kinda full of crap. And yeah, it was only that post that BJ mentioned it in, frankly, she really didn’t care what was done with her.
I want to do this because it will be meaningful to ME. A carbon atom is a carbon atom. Your body trades atoms all the time, so any carbon captured at the time of the cremation would have been in her body, what, a month? More? Less? Not long, I wouldn’t think.
So, I’m not naive enough to think that I’m capturing the life essence of BJ in this, or any romantic crap like that. And if I talked about it enough, I’d talk myself out of doing it, but if I did, I’d be afraid that I crapped out on the last romantic thing I could do for her.
Yeah, its expensive. I’m looking at plunking down about 3 grand for a yellow gem, about a third of a caret. Add to that the mounting fee or whatever when I get the thing.
So, y’know, there you go. Like I said, I have time to make the decision.
November 21st, 2006 at 8:23 pm
I, for one, think it’s incredibly romantic, and when is romance ever logical?????
November 21st, 2006 at 9:14 pm
Just to throw this out there—she has two children, and if you get one diamond, you may be creating future conflict about who gets the diamond. It may be good to wait and think about what you could do to memorialize her so that both the kids could share it in the future. Is that completely beside the point??? I have three boys myself, and I just went through my mom’s death and had to parse things out with two other sibs…not fun.
November 21st, 2006 at 10:50 pm
“I’d be afraid that I crapped out on the last romantic thing I could do for her.”
I don’t know whether you will end up going with the diamond or not, but I’m sure you won’t stop doing romantic things for her. You can’t help yourself. You are just BJ’s big romantic guy. Take care…whatever you do is the right thing.
November 22nd, 2006 at 6:57 am
You’re pregnant? Dude, your money worries are sooo over!
Last wishes are very important. I think some of the well intented advice is because LifeGems is a little unusual and un-orthodox. Folks don’t like what they don’t understand or what’s not usual. The whole in ground burial thing is the “norm.” (Not for me, though!)
Follow your heart. And I’ll be praying that the assvice (I love that word) will get lockjaw :)
November 22nd, 2006 at 10:59 am
I’ve told my kids I want them to make me into a diamond when my time comes. I think it’s a neat idea… but obviously your choice. My sister lost her husband several years ago. Even after these four years have passed, the pain still feels fresh on some days. I admire how my sister handled herself during those first few months and when I asked how she did it, she said she had no choice. No words can even begin to express how amazing you are to lay out your soul like you have. I’m a perfect stranger, but I’ve grieved right alongside you and your family. I regret not having had the privilege of knowing BJ.
November 23rd, 2006 at 1:20 pm
Listen. The year I was divorced I was pregnant with 3 little ones, and i left the area to start over. The stress affected the little one, though I thought at the time i was handling it. we went on field trips, i did all the regular mommy things to keep things normal for them.
when baby Daniel was born he was epileptic and lost oxygen during birth, and died at 3 1/2 months. he was beautiful but hurt.
when my family brought us to new york state from texas for comfort and plans, they seemed to think i was crazy for i showed virtually no sign of grief at all, in fact i was energized and cheerful, except when my father, brother and I dug in the family plot and place the baby’s ashes in the ground.
i didn’t really come to terms with the loss until years later, on the death of a pet, and the flood-gates opened and i grieved my heart out. i cried on and off for at least a week.
but at the time, i felt if i cried, i wouldn’t be able to stop, and my children needed me full and active and normal, and so you see there is a precedent for you, someone that can actually say I understand, that it is the same only different.
even the contacts he made, then and as he would have grown.
peace. today and always
elizabeth
galveston
write if you want
November 23rd, 2006 at 2:05 pm
Thanks Elizabeth.
I’m with you. I fully expect it to hit me someday, at an awkward time, and I’ll be OK with that. It’ll hit for months. Right now, I’m able to keep going. Hell, fact is, I’ve only cried about this once or twice in the past few days.
My wailing, or the lack thereof, does nothing for BJ, or me, or the boys. Why force it? I still love her with all of my heart, and I look forward to seeing her again.
November 24th, 2006 at 5:40 pm
it is true.
I have heard of those that are clear and happy on the death of a loved one, that KNOW all is well. Via religion, belief in reincarnation, some sense of the way it works.
I do believe all that, and felt then that if I were all I should be that I could FEEL like that too, and after time, I do.
and you are right about what is the point in crying.
yet
I mean, no matter what you believe, when the realization hits that she isn’t here anymore, you will be sad.
With my mom, there were impulses to ask her things, call when they had severe weather either here or in New York, apologize for something or ask for an apology for something else. Things like that. And in “talking to myself” in the sense of having real conversations with her, I actually resolve stuff. I mean I never thought I’d run out of time.
you know, I have never seen a forum on the death of a loved one.
oh, what i would have given for guidance or even acknowledgment. Someone to talk to.
maybe there were books, but for god’s sake i had three little kids, not time or money. (no computers!!) I guess partitioning off the part that missed him, the guilty thoughts that there is no way to not have, the what if’s . . . was the only way.
my other son cried and wanted Daniel back for two years (till 4) and i have to say affected poor relationship choice. i am still amazed at how i let my kids at times create major direction in my life, and am still amazed at how in general they were often a good direction.
Well, this is about you, not me.
This is a good thing, man.